tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post116839540811819414..comments2024-03-23T18:50:32.902-04:00Comments on Telling Secrets: Anglicans 'can reject women priest'Elizabeth Kaetonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168987129064811312007-01-16T17:38:00.000-05:002007-01-16T17:38:00.000-05:00Presiding Bishop Jefferts Shori is still on a lear...Presiding Bishop Jefferts Shori is still on a learning curve. <BR/><BR/>Why not talk to those directly affected by the Dallas Plan and see how it's working for them?<BR/><BR/>Warning: what you will hear won't sound anything like the "middle postion."<BR/><BR/>Neither will it sound anything like the truth.<BR/><BR/>Jack Iker is in violation of the constitution and canons of the Episcopal Church. Period. End of sentence. That's not a threat of presentment. That's just cause.<BR/><BR/>And, when - not if - that happens, neither the Panel of Reference, nor the ABC - or, for that matter, anyone in the Anglican Communion - will be able to change the facts.Elizabeth Kaetonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168980840744248802007-01-16T15:54:00.000-05:002007-01-16T15:54:00.000-05:00Don't forget to read whole sentences. What I said ...Don't forget to read whole sentences. What I said was "It's the pastoral compromise called the 'Dallas Plan', now affirmed and endorsed as faithful to the canons of the Episcopal Church by the ABC's Panel of Reference and by Presiding Bishop Katharine Jefferts Schori." I was not stating that she came up with the plan herself or even whether thinks its a good idea.<BR/><BR/>Would I still be lying if I said that on January 9th the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reported, "Schori supports the Dallas Plan. 'My sense is that the Dallas Plan provides for women and seems to be adequate, and our understanding is that it does seem to be responsive to the canons,' she said"? <BR/> <BR/>Rather than calling people liars and threatening presentments, what if we thoughtfully considered whether the "middle position" that Grace articulated is or is not the same as the Dallas Plan.Fr Timothy Matkinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10794558184459092532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168794466785681182007-01-14T12:07:00.000-05:002007-01-14T12:07:00.000-05:00Hmmmm, Horse trading, what a riddle. The Dallas P...Hmmmm, Horse trading, what a riddle. The Dallas Plan sounds a little like "God in the Box" theology. Stallion vs. Gelding. Even with all the veils of the Temple, the lead Mare will never ever want to be a boy horse. The Mare of the Moon knows how to fly. Listen to what She says, in her own words, pg 157-160 in her book, A Wing and a Prayer.<BR/><BR/>God continue to bless our gifted PB Katharine Jefferts Schori, she is too smart to be pulled out of the sky by the spitting of boys and humble enough to sit at their table for lunch.Deborah Sproulehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01722982660416977832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168659374766065642007-01-12T22:36:00.000-05:002007-01-12T22:36:00.000-05:00Oh, and Bishop Katharine has NOT "endorsed" the Da...Oh, and Bishop Katharine has NOT "endorsed" the Dallas Plan.<BR/><BR/>Puuuuuleeezzzeeee!<BR/><BR/>How can you misconstrue her quote about "satisfying the canons" to be an "endorsement"?<BR/><BR/>Is lying endemic to the Diocese of Ft. Worth- sort of floating free form in the diocesan ether - or is it something you boys learn from the example of your bishop?Elizabeth Kaetonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168659108180755362007-01-12T22:31:00.000-05:002007-01-12T22:31:00.000-05:00The Dallas Plan is a lie - a gentleman's agreement...The Dallas Plan is a lie - a gentleman's agreement in the tradition of a Texas horse-trade. Except, ahem, if they hadn't noticed, women ARE NOT horses!<BR/><BR/>In 10 years, only three women have been ordained in "The Dallas Plan."<BR/><BR/>It's Mr. Stanton, of Dallas, trying to serve the church and Mr. Iker trying to get his own misogynist way.<BR/><BR/>The Panel of Reference recommendations encourage a flagrant disobedience to the UNAMBIGUOUS constitution and canons of TEC. <BR/><BR/>They will be of no help - no help whatsoever - when )not IF_ Mr. Iker is brought up on presentment.Elizabeth Kaetonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168658799321370282007-01-12T22:26:00.000-05:002007-01-12T22:26:00.000-05:00Grace,Good ideas. In fact, you have just described...Grace,<BR/><BR/>Good ideas. In fact, you have just described something that actually exists. It's the pastoral compromise called the "Dallas Plan", now affirmed and endorsed as faithful to the canons of the Episcopal Church by the ABC's Panel of Reference and by Presiding Bishop Katharine Jefferts Schori.Fr Timothy Matkinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10794558184459092532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168529506187720562007-01-11T10:31:00.000-05:002007-01-11T10:31:00.000-05:00Another morning, the snakes haven't taken over my ...Another morning, the snakes haven't taken over my kitchen yet. I'm sipping holiday black tea with cream this morning. It's better than beer any time of day. I'm sipping between prayers as I read today's lectionary. Paul gets going on his circumcised and uncircumcised lesson again. The boys keep missing the point. Poor boys have such a burden to carry<BR/>as though they still wait for a savior to tell them whether to 'snip' or 'not snip'. Since I'm such a girl of God lead by my Christ I know better than to dicker over tiny details of men. <BR/>So, my cup is now empty, I rejoice in my female emptiness. I'll pray for the boys too, even though they do not get it. With or without beer the boys must swallow the bitter truth that I will never follow them. Sorry.Deborah Sproulehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01722982660416977832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168516469658404642007-01-11T06:54:00.000-05:002007-01-11T06:54:00.000-05:00Elizabeth - the Admiral of Morality has a very int...Elizabeth - the Admiral of Morality has a very interesting post quoting one of the Executive Council members comments from the HOB/D Listserv. It speaks to modern racism hiding within the folds of theology. It's excellent!episcopalifemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18092579249862725163noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168475642183006862007-01-10T19:34:00.000-05:002007-01-10T19:34:00.000-05:00"...not only calls for flagrant disobedience of th..."...not only calls for flagrant disobedience of the constitution and canons of the Episcopal Church, but also preserves and promotes a system of institutional sexism and misogyny.” <BR/><BR/>Elizabeth, tweek that verbage just a bit, and you'll have the preamble for the looming covenant. Your plane ticket is in the mail. <BR/><BR/>I'm afraid that I am too old to develop a taste for beer, warm, cold, or otherwise. As a kid, I thought it smelled a bit like pee, but maybe that's just American beer. What would we do without MadPriest around to keep us focused on the important things?KJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15701224049914946896noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168450833269250572007-01-10T12:40:00.000-05:002007-01-10T12:40:00.000-05:00I know how to serve beer, my darling. I just don'...I know how to serve beer, my darling. I just don't drink the stuff. (Makes you smell rather like an old sock.)<BR/><BR/>When I'm across the pond, I order a proper G&T - except you Brits don't serve it with any where near enough ice or gin.<BR/><BR/>But, I never complain. I close my eyes, sip slowly and dream of home.Elizabeth Kaetonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168431678906022292007-01-10T07:21:00.000-05:002007-01-10T07:21:00.000-05:00ElizabethWhat I think you fail to understand (or, ...Elizabeth<BR/>What I think you fail to understand (or, petulantly refuse to understand) is the importance of serving beer at the right temperature.<BR/>I'm sure most of your readers will agree with me on this.MadPriesthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15120376342802143188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-1168402196331413892007-01-09T23:09:00.000-05:002007-01-09T23:09:00.000-05:00"also preserves and promotes a system of instituti...<I>"also preserves and promotes a system of institutional sexism and misogyny"</I><BR/><BR/>Sheesh. You tell 'em!marnanelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08335477330828148496noreply@blogger.com