tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post5562450727108840950..comments2024-03-23T18:50:32.902-04:00Comments on Telling Secrets: "The Spirit blows where it wills . . ."Elizabeth Kaetonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-82768308207760924002008-01-30T16:47:00.000-05:002008-01-30T16:47:00.000-05:00Elizabeth,I guess I'm too new to the Diocese to ha...Elizabeth,<BR/><BR/>I guess I'm too new to the Diocese to have detected any hint of "being on the Bishop's team," but perhaps I simply didn't know what to listen for. I will say that the Candidates' Forum was well attended with not only the candidates but those like me who didn't know them at all. The forum solidified my votes in some key races, for example, the GC Deputies election on the lay side. <BR/><BR/>There was some discussion, I forget where now, about how to have more information on both candidates and what the offices themselves are all about. (I believe you were in that hearing, as I recall.) That would be a good thing. We also need more time to hear candidates and a larger room to do it. Of course, this convention was important because specifically of the GC election, and not only because it was +Mark's first. <BR/><BR/>He will get the hang of presiding. I was most disappointed in his tendency to assume there was no dissent. I was very disappointed in the motion to stop debate on the nclusive language resolution. That wasn't +Mark's doing, of course, but I wonder if that's who Newark does things in general.<BR/><BR/>Pray for the Church!<BR/><BR/>RFSJRFSJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15164772153139719659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-437295166772815242008-01-29T21:13:00.000-05:002008-01-29T21:13:00.000-05:00Rev. Elizabeth,I am a rather good mountain dulcime...Rev. Elizabeth,<BR/><BR/>I am a rather good mountain dulcimer player, folk singer, d'hbran drummer and sometimes gutarist. A few years ago I was asked to play and teach at a dulcimer festival. It seems that the director of music considers me one of the last singers of the <I>"old civil rights songs."</I> <BR/><BR/>I learned a fair number of those songs in marches and I do still sing them when I have a gig and they seem to fit. But I was interested enough to think a bit about what had happened. <BR/><BR/>First, it is not that African Americans do not know the history. They simply wish to forget the movement. We are a bit embarresing to their sense of accomplishment. Almost no blacks sing the protest songs now. <BR/><BR/>Second, a lot of the whites have moved on. They 'won' when the Civil Rights Act passed so they went to other battles or bought homes in the burbs. Almost no white folks sing those songs. Besides, Besides, they know the blacks don't. <BR/><BR/>So, I am about the only person still performing and singing "If You Can't Find Me At the Back of the Bus." And I don't get a lot of work. <BR/><BR/>I play for the occaisional church service, most recently the closing of Church of the Meadiator on Chicago's Southwest Side. But that was not a time and place for protest songs.<BR/><BR/>I guess the only ones still widely heard have become camp songs. "Blowing in the Wind," and "This Land is Your Land" both totally misunderstood, are sung at camp by born again types now. ;-)<BR/><BR/>So too with gender I think. The reveolution is passing by. There wont be many of its singers or activists at center stage in a short while. <BR/><BR/>FWIW<BR/>jimBJimBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17312606954135884910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-62056377290588871092008-01-29T10:54:00.000-05:002008-01-29T10:54:00.000-05:00Regarding Hilary's slide - I live in NY and am a f...Regarding Hilary's slide - I live in NY and am a fan of the Senator's. She has turned out to be a much better senator than I expected (I confess that I was afraid it would be mostly a platform to run for president. She's managed to do that AND represent the needs of her constituency. I applaud her).<BR/><BR/>Recently my enthusiasm for her candidacy has waned. Not so much for anything she has done but for the way the former President has been acting. He seems to be running an almost "co-presidency" campaign. That concerns me. It would be bad for the historical trend for future women in the Oval office, it would be bad from a leadership point of view (Bill, in fact, will have no official powers. I'm not sure he really believes that)and it would create confusion in the minds of the nation.<BR/><BR/>All of which could shorten Hilary's presidency to a single term and return a Republican (quite likely a "no nonsense, tough leader" type. Think Rudy G.) to the White House.<BR/><BR/>She needs to get Bill on a leash (I can't even type that with a straight face)<BR/><BR/>Just one point of view.EYouthWNYhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07826033603475277668noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-45104962931247728932008-01-29T04:31:00.000-05:002008-01-29T04:31:00.000-05:00I think your new "up yours" blog photo says it all...I think your new "up yours" blog photo says it all.MadPriesthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15120376342802143188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-18962718701887076542008-01-28T22:44:00.000-05:002008-01-28T22:44:00.000-05:00How right you are. When I was teaching the Anglic...How right you are. When I was teaching the Anglican Tradition and Life course with Bill Countryman at CDSP a few years ago we had a bunch of students who had no idea who the Philadelphia Eleven were... or how recently women got to be seated as Deputies at GC...<BR/><BR/>As for the language issue, I have a rant about that which I will save for when I am less sleep-deprived. I'll just say that I am amazed (not positively) at how slowly it has taken to move the issue of inclusive language forward. We were raising the issue in the 1970s, for cryin' out loud. In many ways the RC church (of which I was a member till 7 years ago -- 6 years formally --) is ahead of us. Seriously. (I mean as a whole and in local communities -- I don't equate "church" with "hierarchy.") I'll write more when I am less tired.<BR/><BR/>Thanks for the report!Jane Rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13814517077774999407noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-42546749994537517162008-01-28T22:17:00.000-05:002008-01-28T22:17:00.000-05:00I maybe overstated my case.It is a part, not the w...I maybe overstated my case.<BR/>It is a part, not the whole thing.<BR/>Another part is a lack of institutional memory. The students I talk to do not get what the world was like.Frair Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03855036304956508405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-78882560049308684762008-01-28T18:27:00.000-05:002008-01-28T18:27:00.000-05:00You may be right. It is entirely possible that I'...You may be right. It is entirely possible that I've misread this whole thing. Frankly, I think too much attention is payed to the generational gap. It feels to me like the latest "toy". You know. Like, "hey, what's your sign?" Or, "Say, I'll bet he's an ESTJ." We look for easy answers to complex human conditions. <BR/><BR/>We shall see. Thanks, Friar John, for your contribution to this conversation. I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong. I'm just sayin' . . . .Elizabeth Kaetonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-58150974381875449582008-01-28T17:07:00.000-05:002008-01-28T17:07:00.000-05:00Could it be that you are misreading some of this? ...Could it be that you are misreading some of this? <BR/>Questions of gender and race are looked at differently by younger people since the circumstances are different. To use the political issues, I’ll point out that the endorsements for both Clinton and Obama tend to fall along generational lines, and I think that may be the real issue. It is hard to describe, and it may be hard to hear, but we don’t get motivated by the same things. We are an over stimulated generation, given to almost nervous exhaustion and now that we have reached adulthood, and are trying to move into positions of authority the differences are becoming more distinct. From what I gather from many women my age it’s not about “doing what the boys do” – and they would find that deeply offensive – but rather trying to chart their own course. That will mean that it will look different from time to time, including the thorny issue of language. I’ll refrain from commenting upon the political situation since it tends to make me unpopular.Frair Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03855036304956508405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-67073336700302730862008-01-28T14:21:00.000-05:002008-01-28T14:21:00.000-05:00Wow! No announcement of this on SFiF. When did th...Wow! No announcement of this on SFiF. When did this happen? Hmmm . . . . . . . . .So, what happens to the Kennedy's vocation at the Episcopal Church where they are now rectors? Will they be asked to vacate the property or allowed to stay? <BR/><BR/>Very interesting times.Elizabeth Kaetonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06787552280232329081noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-29373297.post-44902750310341595612008-01-28T11:41:00.000-05:002008-01-28T11:41:00.000-05:00"However, I don't think most of the diocesan deput..."However, I don't think most of the diocesan deputies understood either how these bodies work or the importance of the qualifications and expertise of the candidates are needed and required. The operative dynamic seemed to be name recognition and the association with those who are working on the new bishop's 'team.'"<BR/><BR/>Elizabeth, this was the "spirit" of our convention too. It was clear that the bishop's team was going to get elected. It is also very clear that that team's understanding of the Constitution and Canon's is NOT what we once thought it was. <BR/><BR/>I am especially concerned about the backlash and especially from the younger women. They do not know how their privilidges were won for them and do not want to know. They think that they should speak what the boys speak.<BR/><BR/>Another piece of info: Matt and Anne Kennedy have resigned their orders and Tony Seel has been deposed for abandonment.<BR/><BR/>I don't think that we progressives should see this as a victory--what this "reordering the church" has done is put the new wave moderates in charge which scares me much more than the conservatives.<BR/><BR/>"You are neither hot nor cold, and I will vomit you forth from my mouth"Muthah+https://www.blogger.com/profile/10589837671378205837noreply@blogger.com